TCCC training

[CS Boomis]

Like the title says, I’m trying to find an outfit within cat slinging distance of central OK that is a credible training outfit. My kid has made a hard turn towards field medical training through CAP. That coupled with the fact that my ass isn’t getting any faster I need to get differentially useful. I want to get the two of us past the bandaid and splint phase.

Suggestions?

 

[JEVapa]

I’ll look around and see. Most civilian TCCC is dumbed way down from what it really is. I have some material I can look at. Some of the training sites are just sticks and rags or first responder classes anyway.

 

[JEVapa]

Badlands Tactical has a TCCC course but it looks like an advanced first responder. They cover a few topics below, but it's still a dumbed down TCCC.
Their course objectives:

• The MARCH algorithm
• The phase of casualty care
• Correct application of hemorrhage control devices
• Correct application of direct pressure for hemorrhage control
• Correct application of wound packing
• The difference between care under fire and tactical field care

I asked who is doing their classes, EMTs or Medics or what. We'll see what they come back with.

 

[CS Boomis]

Thanks a bunch! I had some buddies who went to a LR shooting class at Badlands down around Lawton thirty some odd years ago. Is that the same place? I’m not looking for a personality driven light show. I just want solid advanced training for the worst case scenarios, not a LARPing weekend where I get to wear my cammy jammies. You don’t have to get too far off the blacktop these days to be in areas where emergency service response times are no bueno.

 

[JEVapa]

Thanks a bunch! I had some buddies who went to a LR shooting class at Badlands down around Lawton thirty some odd years ago. Is that the same place? I’m not looking for a personality driven light show. I just want solid advanced training for the worst case scenarios, not a LARPing weekend where I get to wear my cammy jammies. You don’t have to get too far off the blacktop these days to be in areas where emergency service response times are no bueno.

Yes, same place. @ssgrock3 went there several times for long range intro and follow up classes. Like I said, I'm waiting on an answer from them.

The most important part of a civilian first responder/stop the bleed course IMO is knowing how to apply treatments correctly and appropriately. Correctly means it's doing what it's supposed to do and the treatment (bandage, Pressure dressing, occlusive dressing, etc) procedure (physical how-to) is correct or good enough. Appropriately means the treatment applied is the one that the condition requires and not something that isn't needed or can cause further harm. If you chop a toe off, you're not going to use a tourniquet. Everyone gets taught tourniquets and throw them on everything but don't know why they're doing it or if it's even called for. You're not going to cric someone who has ZERO facial trauma that a Jtube or NPA can treat. etc
Soldiers and Marines get taught certain buddy aid and self aid tasks and are usually pretty good. They'll tie alot of knots and shit but mostly their stuff will be good enough. Cops on the other hand, are the worst. The last time I helped train anyone was some cops who were talking about "T Tri C" and tourniquets, and "cric'ing" someone, but when they put on treatments per the survey or class, they looked like a four year retread did it. Bad training from EMTs and no follow up I guess.

A good start is to buy this book just for reference.

PHTLS: Prehospital Trauma Life Support, Military Edition

As the required textbook for NAEMT's worldwide prehospital trauma life support course, Prehospital Trauma Life Support (PHTLS) is the compre

shop.elsevier.com

 

[CS Boomis]

Just rereading your last post and that kind of spun a mental wheel. I don’t know why I just assumed that field trauma/triage training was executed by a higher level medical practitioner. My grandfather was an ER doc way back when doctors were switched on 24/7. He did a lot of pioneering work in emergency medicine. I just kind of assumed that something like TC3 would be guided by that level of preparation. The higher the quality of work out in the dirt the more effectively the continuity of treatment can be executed when conditions improve.

As an aside, do the SF medics still go through the Dog School? I remember reading quite a bit about that back when my aspirations were to wear different boots to work.

 

[JEVapa]

And this book

Where There Is No Doctor A Vil by David Werner: Good (2020) | SecondSale

ISBN: 9780942364156 - 2nd Edition - Soft cover - Hesperian Health Guides - 2020 - Condition: Good - Item in good condition and has highlighting/writing on text. Used texts may not contain supplemental items such as CDs, info-trac etc. - Where There Is No Doctor A Vil

www.abebooks.com

Look for Where there is no Dentist as well

 

[JEVapa]

Just rereading your last post and that kind of spun a mental wheel. I don’t know why I just assumed that field trauma/triage training was executed by a higher level medical practitioner.

Almost all TCCC and advanced medical training (field care/Prehospital and nursing) in the Army (probably Navy and Marines too) is done by NCOs. In the civilian world, TCCC and sticks and rags courses are almost always done by former medics and EMTs to get extra money. Colleges and universities will usually have whatever instructors they've trained. Most doctors and APPs I've met won't waste their time teaching this. They'll give lectures at the beginning or something but that's about it.
Doctors will train procedures meant for hospitals and clinics like PIC lines, Femoral sticks, etc.

Alot of people think that an individual can't do first responder tasks or any medical interventions without being a certified trained medical professional...this is complete ignorance and nonsense. When the Uvalde thing happened, several folks at the other place, including a "teacher" stated they wouldn't do anything to help the children. This one effeminate beta stated that he would just hold their hand and comfort them until they die. What a fckn pussy. Absolutely no call for that kind of cowardice.

My grandfather was an ER doc way back when doctors were switched on 24/7. He did a lot of pioneering work in emergency medicine. I just kind of assumed that something like TC3 would be guided by that level of preparation. The higher the quality of work out in the dirt the more effectively the continuity of treatment can be executed when conditions improve.

No. TCCC originated in the 90s as a direct result of Mogadishu. The TCCC committee examined all modern battlefield trauma and found that the majority of the preventable deaths on the battlefield were exsanguination and pneumothorax. They also found out that 90% of combat deaths happened before they ever got to a medical facility and iirc 80% ish of those were preventable. That's why the procedures of ABCs changed to MARCH. The original TCCC committee was military surgeons and Medics in SOCOM and DoD runs the committee now. TCCC now has the civilian blob attached but at least it’s got accreditation.

As an aside, do the SF medics still go through the Dog School? I remember reading quite a bit about that back when my aspirations were to wear different boots to work.

There haven't been dogs in use since the late 60s or early 70s. They used caprines for the patient models, but I recall as I retired, that they don't do live tissue training anymore. It's all on multimillion dollar mannequins now. They use the caprines for the vet and nursing blocks.


Updated

 

[Ndenway]

Lots of basic classes out there, cpr, aed, basic first aid, basic triage etc.

Most courses are basics with the intention of teaching you how to keep someone alive until emts/paramedics arrive & take over then transport person to the hospital.

Check SOR training in moore (they do mostly security courses, but also have cpr, first aid, aed etc courses),

Also red cross, votechs etc do basic courses.

As posted above, a lot of "certified" instructors are former emts, paramedics, corpmen and some have real medical training but couldn't afford tuition anymore and dropped out to work in other fields of study.

I have basic cpr/aed/first aid/triage certs because places I worked it was required & training was from certified instructors.

You do cpr correctly on someone, you will crack some of their ribs and you will know quick how out of shape you are cause your stamina will wear out fast.

 

[CS Boomis]

I have been trained in the basics CPR, AED and the most pedantic stop the bleed class that could even pass for training. It’s the knowing that I don’t know enough that’s driving the bus. Like JEVapa said earlier, you can end up half assing the job or applying the completely incorrect procedure. The current risk environment has to be driving the actuaries nuts. I just want to be more prepared than I currently am.

 

[Ndenway]

Yes,

lack of knowledge of the initial "responder" trying to be a doc can and will cause life long damage if not death to the ill/injured person,

It also makes the real doctor, or team of doctors job very difficult trying to correct the damage caused by the first responder trying to help when they should have stuck to the basics.

 

[Hillside Desolate]

Yes,

lack of knowledge of the initial "responder" trying to be a doc can and will cause life long damage if not death to the ill/injured person,

It also makes the real doctor, or team of doctors job very difficult trying to correct the damage caused by the first responder trying to help when they should have stuck to the basics.